ZZ600E3
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:19 pm

Bravia Sync Issue with Raspi

Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:37 pm

Hi,

First post here, I have trawled the forums and the rest of the net and seen similar issues but I need some clarification if what I'm experiencing is unique or common place.

I have a Sony TV and AV receiver that I have configured to work via the Bravia Sync so a singular remote and button press can power the system on and off as well as both items being able to auto switch modes etc to suit what I want to connect or watch. Whenever I use my Raspberry Pi (which plugs in via the AV receiver's HDMI), this link seems to get broken or corrupted. The TV and receiver will no longer turn on and off together and certain functions such as a the Theatre mode button fail to be actioned, yet the TV light will blink to register he button press.

I have to reset the TV back to factory defaults for the TV to be able to detect he AV receiver again via HDMI control and set itself back up. Prior to this master reset, the TV will pause when searching for HDMI devices to sync with and remains searching until I either cancel or pull the HDMI cable that links the AV receiver. It doesn't matter if the Pi is pulled from the set up, everything works a treat until the moment it is used and then no amount of tinkering, turning on/off or plugging/unplugging will allow the TV and AV to see each other until at least one of them is totally reset.

This is really frustrating because my whole project with the at least one Raspi is to get a low cost media server running and I'm worried about the safety of my equipment if it messes with the hardware. The TV is a Sony 52W4000, AV receiver is Model DA2400ES and the Pi was sourced from Farnell.

I have an RS components one on order which I hope doesn't do this but is this a design fault, manufacturing fault or just an unlucky set up I have that doesn't get along with the Pi no matter who built the board?

I'd much appreciate feedback from other regarding the issue.

Many Thanks

drgeoff
Posts: 12575
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 6:39 pm

Re: Bravia Sync Issue with Raspi

Tue Jul 31, 2012 7:23 pm

I will be very surprised if the RPi from RS, running the same OS as the Farnell one, will behave differently.

Can only suggest you have a look in the Projects/Media Centres and Gaming part of the forum, especially looking for CEC or HDMI-CEC which is the generic name for Sony's Bravia Sync.

A small consolation is that the eventual fix for your problem is much more likely to be a software one than hardware.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Therket
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 3:48 pm

Re: Bravia Sync Issue with Raspi

Mon Aug 06, 2012 4:08 pm

Hi,

I'm experiancing very similar issues with a similar setup, although I have different devices.
My Setup:
1) TV (Philips)
2) AVR (Denon)
3) PS3
4) Satellite Receiver (no-name, no HDMI CEC)
5) Raspberry Pi
The TV is connected to the AVR solely using HDMI-ARC, all other devices are connected to the AVR.

Before the RPi was attached, everything related to HDMI-ARC or HDMI-CEC went just fine and very stable, e.g.:
1) Turn on PS3, when selecting the PS3 in TV's menu
2) Turn off AVR, when TV is turned off
3) AVR switches to PS3-Input, when PS3 is turned on
4) AVR and PS3 handle supported audio-formats correctly
5) PS3 can be controlles with TV remote
6) ...

When I introduced the RPi, most of the above don't work anymore. As I didn't know exactly, when the setup broke, I restored the initial configuration, I disconnected the RPi.
Sidenote: Restoring the initial setup wasn't as easy as expected, the AVR-PS3 link worked right from the start, but the TV didn't learn about the PS3 again. I had to disable HDMI-Control in PS3, reboot PS3, enable HDMI-Control, reboot PS3 -> Initial setup working again.

Now to the testings with the RPi. As I didn't know, if the issue was related in
a) RPi hardware
b) RPi firmware
c) raspbmc running on RPi
d) modified rpi-cecd running on RPi
I decided to start with the most simple setup: RPi without SD-Card and without power

Test-Case 1 RPi without SD-Card and without power
Result not working
The TV is not able to start the PS3 anymore. It just says "Establishing connection..." and after a few seconds "Device not available".

Test-Case 2 RPi without SD-Card and with power
Result working
The TV is able to start the PS3. The RPi does nothing but showing one red light.

I planned to do more tests (and I think I will do), but I think, we have a hardware-design error here :-(
The RPi seems to "consume" CEC signals if it does not have power. I don't know CEC specifications, but I think a "dead" device should just do nothing (as my non-CEC satellite receiver does).

If no other CEC issues come up with the RPi being powered, I can live with that. In my setup, the only reason for the RPi not being powered all the time is that it shares it's power source with my mobile phone. As soon as I got a second power source, it will be kept alive 24/7. But still, this is not nice behaviour..

Regards
Jens

ZZ600E3
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:19 pm

Re: Bravia Sync Issue with Raspi

Thu Aug 09, 2012 12:13 pm

Hi Jens,

Sorry about not seeing your post, was silly enough not to subscribe to my own thread.

I have an identical setup hardware wise

1. Sony Bravia TV
2. Sony AV Receiver
3. Humax FreeSat Box
4. PS3 fat version with no CEC
5. Xbox
6. Raspberry Pi
I only ever used the link to sync the TV and AV so no control from other devices

I've tried to dig for more info in the media centre section on the forum but so far no replies to my posts in t the threads so will keep trying.

Without HDMI-CEC, my girlfriend can't turn on the TV setup so I get no Saturday/Sunday morning lie ins...... It's imperative I get this working ;)

I've had all kinds of funny occurances with the Pi connected from audio over HDMI being broken to Remote presses being acknowledged but not actioned. I'd be able to live with the problem to a degree but the fact it disables audio over HDMI after a full power cycle no matter if it's the TV or AV receiver set to output the signal it's just a pain to get functioning again.

Since my initial post, I've played with the new build of OpenElec XBMC and set up the CEC on that and from it I can fully control the devices and power all things on and off. But, trying to power the TV off will result in the AV receiver being left on when it should go in to stand by as well. And once that is manually powered off I no longer have sound as mention above the next time it's turned on.

But, it seems that you have found the same enigma I have, that an unpowered Pi causes the issue too. I can factory reset my TV without the Pi connected so CEC is working, introduce the Pi without power and everything goes kaput. If I factory reset with it still in the loop then the initial scan for devices to add doesn't even work. If I power on the Pi and then factory reset, I find the AV receiver and also two entries can pop up for the Pi, one being Player(RapsberryPi_li) and Recorder(XBMC). But this still results in the TV and AV receiver not able to control one another.

Just how on Earth can the Pi without power cause this issue? Can it take power from the HDMI cable and mess everything up?

I've subscribed here now so any responses I'll see immediately :)

ZZ600E3
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:19 pm

Re: Bravia Sync Issue with Raspi

Thu Aug 09, 2012 5:57 pm

Ok,

Sorry for the double reply here as I have just done some testing now that I am home. I have bypassed the AV receiver and plugged directly in to the TV and done a hard reset with the Pi on and powered up. I can confirm that the fault lies directly with the Raspberry Pi because as long as I keep it powered up from the time the reset it done, the TV can over and over detect it when scanning for devices. But as soon as the Pi has a HDMI cable connected when it is not powered up (i.e. Pi powered down with HDMI connected or just plugged in ready to be powered up) then the TV will refuse to see it and all other devices connected be it via AV receiver or directly in to the TV Sets HDMI Ports.

I have connected the AV receiver again and done the same thing, as long as the Pi is powered up from the initial factory reset, then the TV is happy as Larry as they say to work with the receiver. It's as if the return channel from the TV does not send any info to it when the Pi has messed it up and the AV receiver no longer scans it's connections as the instruction to do so no longer comes.

So the Pi is doing something when it is connected to the devices when powered down that is causing the TV sets to fail when using HDMI-CEC and this for me is a real deal breaker because you may not even intend to use it as a media centre but still mess up your TV setup.

What on Earth can the Pi be doing that is stopping the TV sets from sending commands down the HDMI cables?

Advice would be very much appreciated at this time.

Thanks,
Chris

Therket
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 3:48 pm

Re: Bravia Sync Issue with Raspi

Sat Aug 11, 2012 8:24 am

Hi Chris,

I wonder why this topic doesn't get more attention. Maybe it's because od the title, are you able to change it to something more general like "Raspi breaks existing HDMI CEC Connections"?
In my opinion, this issue is so general, that either other people should be annoyed by it, too, or we really have defective devices.

As long as I'm not able to keep the RPi powered up 24/7, it's an absolute deal breaker for me, too. Right now, it's disconnected...

I tried to measure resistance between HDMI Pin 13 (CEC) and 17 (CEC Ground). I think the Pi pulls 13 down to GND and so disturbed the whole CEC communication. But the Pins are so small I didn't manage to connect measure equipment up to now.

There are specialized HDMI cables that do not connect Pin 13 on purpose to workaround CEC issues. This might be a final workaround for us, of course, we loose any RPi-CEC functionality with that.

Regards
Jens

ZZ600E3
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2012 6:19 pm

Re: Bravia Sync Issue with Raspi

Sat Aug 11, 2012 11:20 am

Hi Jens,

I've started a thread in the media centre section http://www.raspberrypi.org/phpBB3/viewt ... 00#p147600 so keep an eye on that. Someone has already stated pin 14 is the ESD protection and the possible culprit but I don't think it's a good idea to start tearing protection pins out of the HDMI slot that could leave the devices open to damage from power surges.

Return to “Troubleshooting”