Hugh-Roger
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what firmware version

Sat Feb 15, 2014 10:20 pm

I am trying to fathom which version of firmware I have. I installed the 17th Jan 2014 wheezy but have done updates on f/w and OS since then.

firmware shows up as :

root@mtu:~# vcgencmd version
Jan 17 2014 19:57:56
Copyright (c) 2012 Broadcom
version 55634e095f4d31d2610f3fa93a12990b09d21f80 (clean) (release)

which looks like hex representation of an enormous number.
What does the number mean
What does "clean" mean

Thanks

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DougieLawson
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Re: what firmware version

Sat Feb 15, 2014 10:24 pm

cat /etc/os-version
uname -a
vcgencmd version

Gives you the complete details.

My RPi is running 3.10.30+ with firmware from yesterday.

sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade && sudo rpi-update
Will get you to the same level.
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Fidelius
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 11:19 am

DougieLawson wrote:cat /etc/os-version
uname -a
vcgencmd version

Gives you the complete details.

My RPi is running 3.10.30+ with firmware from yesterday.

sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade && sudo rpi-update
Will get you to the same level.
When I do "uname -a", it says: 3.10.25+ #622 PREEMPT Fri Jan 3 .. 2014
(Before that, I did a "apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade")

How come you got a 3.10.30+ Raspbian?


Concerning firmware and "sudo rpi-update": Some experts including moderators here on the forum say you don't need to do the "rpi-update" and that it's a hack from former times. Some including you say do it.
What do we do with it? :-)

sander2
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 11:36 am

FWIW:

I did the "sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade && sudo rpi-update" cycle, plus a reboot, and I am on 3.10.30+

Code: Select all

pi@raspberrypi ~ $ uname -a
Linux raspberrypi 3.10.30+ #640 PREEMPT Fri Feb 14 19:09:14 GMT 2014 armv6l GNU/Linux
So ... did you do that, including the reboot?

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FTrevorGowen
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 11:37 am

Fidelius wrote: ...
Concerning firmware and "sudo rpi-update": Some experts including moderators here on the forum say you don't need to do the "rpi-update" and that it's a hack from former times. Some including you say do it.
What do we do with it? :-)
My understanding is
1) rpi-update is not a hack,
2) but it may be "bleeding-edge" so a current "fix" under "beta test" may prove to have "broken" something else.
So, if you're sure of "what you're doing" do it, if you're not sure "it's at your own risk" (ie.back up critical stuff first etc.). But, w.r.t. a specific problem you may be advised to do so.
Trev.
Still running Raspbian Jessie or Stretch on some older Pi's (an A, B1, 2xB2, B+, P2B, 3xP0, P0W, 2xP3A+, P3B, B+, and a A+) but Buster on the P3B+, P4B's & P400. See: https://www.cpmspectrepi.uk/raspberry_pi/raspiidx.htm

ghans
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 12:11 pm

My understanding matches that of FTRevorGowen.
The kernel you get via apt-get upgrade is supposed to be
more stable than the one you get via rpi-update .

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Fidelius
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 1:48 pm

Thanks a lot to the previous speakers, now it's clear!

Since everything works fine here, I think I'm going to stay with the stable standard "apt-get upgrade" kernel.
... until somebody knows of some must-have feature which only the "rpi-update" kernel provides. :-)


P.S. Once you do a "rpi-update" to get the "bleeding-edge" / "beta test" kernel & firmware, is there a way back to the normal stable kernel (from "apt-get upgrade") ?

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DougieLawson
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 2:42 pm

Fidelius wrote:
P.S. Once you do a "rpi-update" to get the "bleeding-edge" / "beta test" kernel & firmware, is there a way back to the normal stable kernel (from "apt-get upgrade") ?
If you can find the git commit id (lots of hex digits) you can use
sudo rpi-update hexgitcommitidgoeshere
to revert to any previously commuted update.

If you follow the RPI dev twitter id (they tweet the commits) then it is possible to stay absolutely current - right on the bleeding edge.
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rpdom
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 3:17 pm

You should be able to reinstall the apt-get version with

Code: Select all

sudo apt-get --reinstall install raspberrypi-bootlooader

Hugh-Roger
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 7:28 pm

DougieLawson wrote:cat /etc/os-version
uname -a
vcgencmd version

Gives you the complete details.

My RPi is running 3.10.30+ with firmware from yesterday.

sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade && sudo rpi-update
Will get you to the same level.
Thanks for your reply
As I said, I had already run vcgencmd version (uname is irrelevant here) and got a hex output.
My question was - why am I seeing this instead of a normal version number.

ghans
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 7:33 pm

Looks like a hash referring the revision the firmware was built from.
Obviously only useful to Broadcom employees with access to the company- internal version control system (VCS).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revision_c ... vocabulary

An explanation of hashing in the context of the popular "git" VCS can be found here:

http://www-cs-students.stanford.edu/~bl ... /ch08.html

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DougieLawson
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 7:52 pm

That version is the git commit id so it is useful to everybody. You can use it with rpi-update to revert to a specific version.
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chrisryall
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 9:47 pm

I like to stay up to date, but have no wish to be a beta tester. When should I rpi-update please, this to stay comfortably with versions regarded as "stable"?

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ShiftPlusOne
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Re: what firmware version

Sun Feb 16, 2014 10:28 pm

FTrevorGowen wrote:
Fidelius wrote: ...
Concerning firmware and "sudo rpi-update": Some experts including moderators here on the forum say you don't need to do the "rpi-update" and that it's a hack from former times. Some including you say do it.
What do we do with it? :-)
My understanding is
1) rpi-update is not a hack,
2) but it may be "bleeding-edge" so a current "fix" under "beta test" may prove to have "broken" something else.
So, if you're sure of "what you're doing" do it, if you're not sure "it's at your own risk" (ie.back up critical stuff first etc.). But, w.r.t. a specific problem you may be advised to do so.
Trev.
The moderators in question might've been me and/or plugwash. I am by no means an expert and may get things wrong, but I'll throw it out there anyway.

When the pi was release, we were playing around with buildroot distros, firmware was getting updated frequently and many changes were quite important. So we needed a way to upgrade the firmware. The way to do it was to update from the repo and then copy the firmware files, the kernel and the modules to the relevant folders. Hexxeh made rpi-update and it was pretty useful at the time. However, I am of the opinion that it is indeed a hack. It's not "the right way" to do things, but it is better than having to do it manually or having each person use their own scripts. And since it allowed to downgrade the firmware and get an exact revision, it was awesome.

Now the firmware is a part of the raspberrypi-bootloader package, which also contains the kernel. There are libraspberrypi-* packages which contain some extra userspace stuff like the vc libs and binaries. These are not updated too often, but often enough to ensure that the standard apt-get update; apt-get dist-upgrade; commands will keep your firmware up to date.

However, you may be asked by Dom to upgrade your firmware to a specific revision or the latest version if there is an issue. That is to check if a recently pushed update has fixed the issue. Sometimes people think that they are having problems because of firmware updates, so they may feel like they need to downgrade in order to get a stable system. In other words, there are legitimate uses for rpi-update still.

The problem is that it overwrites files which should be and are typically managed by the distro's package manager. It is possible to end up with a broken install or a version mismatch between the userspace libraries and the firmware. It's a bit like installing a package using apt-get, the downloading a different version, compiling it and overwriting the system's version. There are no 'real' problems with any of this, but for purists, it's just not the right way to do things.

I would say, as a rule of thumbs, use rpi-update if you are helping test the firmware while investigating a potential bug, if you are working on a distro that doesn't keep the firmware up to date (the important ones do), if the raspberrypi-bootloader package has not been updated in a long time and important updates have been released on github or if you just know what you're doing and feel like it's necessary. But I don't think it's good practice to just run it all the time without even checking the commits on github. A recent example where rpi-update was a good idea was when some SD corruption fixes were pushed but the raspberrypi-bootloader package was 3 months out of date.

Hugh-Roger
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Re: what firmware version

Mon Feb 17, 2014 1:06 am

DougieLawson wrote:That version is the git commit id so it is useful to everybody. You can use it with rpi-update to revert to a specific version.
Thanks for the info.

I was already at 3.10.30+ when I made the original post at the start of the thread.
So the hashed version was evident when at 3.10.30+ - but I dont really see the point since this is the OS version and my problem is with the firmware version.

As advised, I have since run :
sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade && sudo rpi-update
and rebooted

uname still shows 3.10.30+
vcgencmd version shows

Feb 14 2014 19:22:36
Copyright (c) 2012 Broadcom
version 45d99f51ad03ec95e6bd087065de3bc825bfce33 (clean) (release)

So the firmware has updated - but I have a different hash now.

Do I have a problem ?

ghans
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Re: what firmware version

Tue Feb 18, 2014 7:57 am

I don't think so - you simply got the most recent firmware.
Should you encounter problems , you can revert like DougieLawson explained - i incorrectly assumed that the hashes refered to the source
code repository instead of the public github.

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ds18s20
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Re: what firmware version

Fri Mar 07, 2014 9:08 pm

In a previous post someone said that the most popular distros do update the firmware automatically;
I just finished update/upgrade but the firmware is still not the latest:

Linux raspberrypi 3.10.25+ #622 PREEMPT Fri Jan 3 18:41:00 GMT 2014 armv6l GNU/Linux

Or could 3.10.25+ be the official current version and 3.10.33+ is early deployment?

Then I did rpi-update and now the firmware is:

Linux raspberrypi 3.10.33+ #654 PREEMPT Fri Mar 7 16:32:08 GMT 2014 armv6l GNU/L

So in summary my question is: why didn't the newest distribution update firmware to 3.10.33+

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DougieLawson
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Re: what firmware version

Fri Mar 07, 2014 9:16 pm

sudo rpi-update
That doesn't happen automatically.
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ds18s20
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Re: what firmware version

Fri Mar 07, 2014 9:32 pm

Um ok which one is it; does the distro update firmware or it doesn't?

ShiftPlusOne seems to believe that the official ones do:
I would say, as a rule of thumbs, use rpi-update if you are helping test the firmware while investigating a potential bug, if you are working on a distro that doesn't keep the firmware up to date (the important ones do).

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DougieLawson
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Re: what firmware version

Fri Mar 07, 2014 10:13 pm

There is a firmware package in the repos but it's way back level compared to the leading edge firmware that gets updated with rpi-update.

Both of my RPis are running with BRANCH=next rpi-update # which includes the USB re-write.
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ShiftPlusOne
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Re: what firmware version

Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:41 am

ds18s20 wrote:Um ok which one is it; does the distro update firmware or it doesn't?

ShiftPlusOne seems to believe that the official ones do:
I would say, as a rule of thumbs, use rpi-update if you are helping test the firmware while investigating a potential bug, if you are working on a distro that doesn't keep the firmware up to date (the important ones do).
Well, the rest of the paragraph would've answered that.
if the raspberrypi-bootloader package has not been updated in a long time and important updates have been released on github or if you just know what you're doing and feel like it's necessary. But I don't think it's good practice to just run it all the time without even checking the commits on github. A recent example where rpi-update was a good idea was when some SD corruption fixes were pushed but the raspberrypi-bootloader package was 3 months out of date.
It depends on what you mean by 'up to date'. You don't update all of your software every time there is a commit to it on the development branch, so why do it with the firmware? You will find that Debian keeps your software up to date, but that does not mean it will pull in every single change from the upstream dev branch. In fact, the wheezy packages are quite old. The same goes for firmware. If you want stable firmware that has been around for a little while, then apt has you covered. If you want firmware that may contain some fixes, but may also make your pi un-bootable (very rare) or break other things (quite common actually), then rpi-update is handy.

Sorry if I was unclear or misleading in the original post.

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algorithm
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Re: what firmware version

Sat May 10, 2014 10:25 am

If you want/need camera-related updates, you will have to run rpi-update all the time.

By the way, the "vcgencmd version" hash seems to be different from the rpi-update git hash. Latest are currently c8ed097f7c23249e702bea3ed6b5720136ba00e4 and 3f722be8d8de6740b32d76ef938a05744bf0d34f, respectively. Check your current rpi-update firmware revision hash via "cat /boot/.firmware_revision". Check latest available firmware hash via https://api.github.com/repos/Hexxeh/rpi ... ads/master (a json file).

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algorithm
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Re: what firmware version

Sat May 10, 2014 11:10 am

Also, I was under the impression that rpi-update was the only way to get firmware updates (possibly including related kernel updates, not sure) and that "apt-get upgrade" could never get firmware updates, only regular software updates (including linux kernels). Is that not true, ie. do some firmware updates, presumable tested & stable versions, get pulled in via apt-get? Or is there some other division where parts of the firmware update, like the videocore maybe, are exclusive to rpi-update?

ghans
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Re: what firmware version

Sat May 10, 2014 11:22 am

Nope , rpi-update is just in the "bleeding edge" , so to speak.

Try

Code: Select all

dpkg -l | grep raspberry
for an overview.

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algorithm
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Re: what firmware version

Sat May 10, 2014 11:57 am

Aren't those just system libraries that *interact* with the firmware? And actual updates of the VideoCore IV firmware still only come via rpi-update? I may well be wrong.

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